I haven't been able to sleep with CPAP, so my sleep lab referred me to a dentist who offers something called "The Full Breath Solution." I believe it was also called the "Silent Night" when it first came out. It was designed by Dr. Bryan Kerapian in the Los Angeles area.

I can't seem to find out much about it from independent sources. Does anyone have any experience with this device?

http://www.cpapalternative.com/Home01.asp

I went to this site, checking it out. As it mentions, there are about 89 different types of Intra-Oral devices out there for Sleep Apnea Treatment. They all essentially work the same, creating a forward movement of the lower jaw, similar to the first aid maneuver called a "Jaw Thrust". They are OK for mild and possibly moderate apnea, but, as I learned first hand, they don't always work well, or work long.

   The biggest caution I can offer, is to ensure that your apnea is effectively treated by it. If there is any doubt, go with the xPAP, it is adjusted under monitored conditions, and not a one size fits all, or a partial custom job, but individualized adjustments.  They can also document the effectiveness of treatment during a titration study.  It is the best way to go.

   You don't, however, explain why you can't tolerate the CPAP. If you would write back to us, someone might be able to offer some solutions to try.


_________________
painless

Sleep Apnea is a Killer! Get it Tested!
Get it Treated! Use the Treatment!

I couldn't tolerate CPAP for a variety of reasons. I tried it every night for a month, going through six different masks in the process. Each night I wore it for between one and two hours (three hours on two occasions) and never once fell asleep... Not for a minute. Depending on the night and which mask I was wearing, it was one or more of the following; uncomfortable, restricted my movement, felt claustrophobic, irritated my nose, hurt my nose, leaked, itched, noisy leaks, pulled, fell out of my nose, I sucked air through my mouth startling me back to alertness, anxiety and panic... I tried two nasal masks, one full face, two with pillows including the hybrid and the worst one of all time, the Oracle II, which blew air directly into my mouth, inflating my cheeks... I had my wife and son try that one. Neither could tolerate it for ten seconds, let alone sleep with it... Each time, I put them on in advance of bed time and even watched TV with a couple of them, hoping I could get used to them... I could watch TV for an hour or more with it in, but never could get relaxed and on the few times I started to feel relaxed, one fo the aforementioned problems would occur... I always felt like there was a monkey on my face and I wasn't sure what it was going to do next... After each unsuccessful attempt at sleep, I would let the mask fall to the floor and go to sleep without it... usually within ten minutes. Of course, the sleep wasn't very rejuvinating, but it proved better than getting no sleep at all with CPAP.

And I can't tell you how I looked forward to getting the CPAP machine while I waited for it. I wish they would put out more realistic advertisements. All they seem to show is some handsome, smiling guy who puts it on, falls immediately to sleep and wakes up feeling like a million bucks the next morning.

I went for my assessment today for "The Full Breath Solution." The doctor does a nice job presenting the device, explaining the difference between it and the rest of the dental devices... His doesn't pull the jaw forward so much as keep the tongue from going back... It seemed minimally intrusive, the ideal solution, if it in fact worked. The people at my sleep lab say they have seen positive results from it and that's who they recommend...  I am still skeptical about claims of success, especially after my experience with CPAP. Still, I was ready to go... Then I found out the cost... $5100 for something that isn't much different than a ten dollar football mouthpiece with a bar going across the back of it to hold your tongue down. I just about choked... Okay, I realize it has to be custom fitted and adjusted... If he had said $1500 I probably would have given it a try... And they wanted me to pull out my credit card and make molds right then after assuring me that my insurance company probably wouldn't pay for much of it, if any... The only thing that gave me any encouragement at all was that they didn't follow me out the door shouting, $4100.... $3100... $2100...

I'm new to this industry, but I already sense exploitation of tired, desperate people... That was the purpose of my post...  I wanted to see if any people had experience with Full Breath, other than those who will profit from my situation... Full Breath  may be a fine product for all I know...  But, at that price I'd just as soon not take one for the team and find out it doesn't work. I'd like to have a bit more information.

I'm on to another dentist on Tuesday to see what he has to offer... Meanwhile, I'll continue dieting and sleeping on my side, which helps more than anything I've tried so far.

Thanks for your input.

Scriptdog,
I want to tell you that I have a Tap 3 dental device which I think is probably saving my life. I tried c-pap for 4 years,every single night,I used my c-pap and never once did I get a restful nights sleep. With the Tap 3 I can sleep,only waking up twice(which I guess is normal for my age,54). I haven't been back for another sleep study yet because I had one just prior to getting the device and my insurance won't pay for it. But I feel a lot better,have more energy and I'm not aggravated every morning anymore due to fighting that machine and masks. I tried many,many different masks.Bought them from the internet,E-bay etc. Nothing helped. I use nasal strips along with the Tap 3. My husbands says I don't snore,toss and turn and he hasn't heard any apneas. I don't know how long it will work but I can not envision myself ever using the c-pap again.

Thanks... TAP 3 is one of the ones I'll be discussing with my dentist on Tuesday.

Anyone with any information about The Full Breath Solution?... The guy has a big office near LA... Supposedly, there are thousands of people using it... I'd like to hear some personal experiences pro or con.

Well, I thank you all for advice... Seems my THERASNORE does lose effectiveness, and cpap Autoset works fine.

It seems my best shot is try the TAP series currently in vogue.

THANX much for warning about the aveosleep TONGUE holder, cheap enough that i could have bitten from desparation for a dental device.

Wish me luck.

Liette,

I have my TAP 3... It took a few nights before I could sleep with it, but on the 4th night I made it several hours and felt better... Now I can make it through the whole night... Problem is, it doesn't seem to be helping... Did it take awhile for you to feel benefit, or did it happen right away.

Hi Scriptdog,
 It does take a while because you shouldn't adjust it all the way at once.It took me about 2 weeks to really get the full benefit. It's not perfect though. I have had to adjust it out even further than what I had thought would work originally. My best advice to to make sure you use the bite pads every single morning. I had stopped because I didn't think I needed to any longer because I had no soreness,but believe me you need to every morning. I am still very happy with the TAP,for me it is a life saver because I just could not stand another night with C-Pap.

I don't know what bite pads are... My dentist never went over that with me...

I've had my TAP-3 for two weeks now...  The first week, I would have to take it out after an hour or two...  I seemed to really be fighting against it when I slept, which made my jaw sore...  Gradually, I got more comfortable with it and each night slept a little longer with it in.  For the last two nights I seem to have stopped fighting it and slept with a relaxed jaw... It's dialed all the way out and I've slept through the night without a problem. After a couple minutes of stretching in the morning, my bite goes back to normal... So tolerating it is no problem...

I'm just not sure it's working... Or how well it's working...  So far I know it's not THE answer, because I don't feel fully refreshed... But, like you say, I'll give it a few weeks to see what I arrive at.

Thanks

Scripdog,
I'm really surprized about you not knowing about the bite pads. My dentist strongly encouraged me to use them because the TAP will change your bite.  TAP has been associated with TMJ problems because of bite alignment changes!

When I sleep, I often breathe through my mouth, which means that my mouth is open.  From what I understand, the Full Breath has a bar in the back that clamps down on your tongue when your mouth is closed.  But what happens when your mouth is open?  Wouldn't it become totally ineffective, not holding the tongue down anymore?

It seems like the mandibular advancement devices have an advantage in this respect given that they are 2 pieces that work even when your mouth is open (for those devices that actually allow you open your mouth).

The only way I could see the Full Breath device solving this problem of open mouth is if you wore some type of chin strap that kept your mouth shut.  Is this a fair assesment?

Dear Linda (moderator),
It would appear that it is not just the link that has disappeared but my entire posts. What a tremendous disservice. Did you not read my posts? I am a bonafide sufferer of sleep apnea offering helpful feedback to those of my peers who also suffer. It would appear that your censorship is motivated by something other than keeping an open forum. Shame on you. If you didn't want a link you should have deleted the link, not the entire post. I would have had no problem with that as I have nothing vested with the link per se - other than the fact that you are keeping valuable information from those who are seeking. I am not the one who benefits financially from any of this information. I am the one who you should be seeking to contribute to your forum. I have found a solution to what other posters are looking for. Again, shame on you and please reply with an appropriate response because if you site "protocal" then I suggest you look once again at the mission statement of your forum.
Sincerely dissappointed,
Jon

Jon,

Your entire posts were not removed.  Do a search of your posts and you will see they are there.  

This is not entirely an open forum, forums of all types have rules and procedures and are operated by the people who created them.  A partial list of forum policies and guidelines are posted on our forum.  This is run by a non-profit organization for sleep apnea, offering this as the internet's only non-commercial forum for this condition, an alternative to other forums that are commercially operated.  We remove links based on our policies, regardless of the intent or the circumstances of the poster.  And the forum reserves the right to lock topics or remove posts for several purposes.  We try and accomodate posters as much as possible. You've been given every opportunity to post your views, within our guidelines.


Linda


_________________
Click here for link to FAQ and topics
Click here for link to section on machines and masks

Ifoundmysolution wrote:

Dear Linda (moderator),
It would appear that it is not just the link that has disappeared but my entire posts. What a tremendous disservice. Did you not read my posts? I am a bonafide sufferer of sleep apnea offering helpful feedback to those of my peers who also suffer. It would appear that your censorship is motivated by something other than keeping an open forum. Shame on you. If you didn't want a link you should have deleted the link, not the entire post. I would have had no problem with that as I have nothing vested with the link per se - other than the fact that you are keeping valuable information from those who are seeking. I am not the one who benefits financially from any of this information. I am the one who you should be seeking to contribute to your forum. I have found a solution to what other posters are looking for. Again, shame on you and please reply with an appropriate response because if you site "protocal" then I suggest you look once again at the mission statement of your forum.
Sincerely dissappointed,
Jon

To “Ifoundmysolution”,

I can see that you are not happy about the deletion of the commercial links that you posted. I am not a moderator, however I would like to address your comments about the moderators and this forum with the following points:  

Commercial Links:
If this forum did not have any policy about posting commercial links, then it would be overrun by
posts from dentists, docs, sleep labs, sales reps, and others to promote the services and products that they are selling.

Accusation of Censorship
You are free to post your story. You have already posted it 4 – 5 times. If people are interested in the product/service, they can choose to contact you - you posted your email address right? You posted the name of the product, and people can look it up on the internet for more info. I did that and read that it was invented by Dr. Bryan Keropian, etc. In addition, the Full Breath thread has been posted on the Oral Applicance Forum for several months, long before your first posts from yesterday.

The “Shame on You” Comment
I, too, am a sufferer of sleep apnea, and I have found this forum to be an amazing resource that has benefited me greatly in my understanding of the disorder and my ability to cope with it. The moderators of this forum work very hard every day on this forum. From what I have seen, they have helped many, many people, and they try to be fair. I cannot say enough good things about the moderators on this forum. I can see that it is not easy to be a moderator of a public internet forum. They hardly deserve this kind of berating for deleting commercial links.

In closing, I think that that moderators and this forum well serve the purpose of the ASAA which is “The ASAA is a non-profit organization dedicated to reducing injury, disability, and death from sleep apnea and to enhancing the well-being of those affected by this common disorder”.

Good day.
Guest MJ

Dear All (Including Moderators),

Some very good points have been brought to my attention both by moderators and other posters. All I can do is agree with the reasons for the policies you have in place with this forum. They do make perfect sense.

Late last night, in an effort to respond to one of the inquiries I had received, I tried to pull up my posts and found them missing. I completely understand the reason to restrict commercial links - that was not an issue at all - I was missing my entire posts. I don't know why they were missing but for lack of any technical reason I'm sure it could easily be something wrong on my end. Maybe a "refresh" issue or just something I goofed up. At any rate, the moderator has assured me that they had nothing to do with it and I have no reason to doubt them.

Now for the important part. I would like to formally apologize. I am guilty of getting very caught up in the passions of something I truly believe in. I really did think I was being censored and felt it was unfair to those who could relate to my story. I thought I was going to die from sleep apnea so I wrote the first things that popped into my mind. In hindsight I can clearly see the value of the feedback I've received from Guest MJ and the moderators. Please forgive my emotional response. I am human and if you think about the trials of your own sleep apnea then perhaps you can relate. I can also see that most in this forum are extremely well versed in the information available here. I am not. I am very new to this forum and I spoke out without being more acquainted with the vast amount of info here.

I am very appreciative of your feedback. Lastly, I am a firm believer in non-profits promoting good. The more I search this site and the individual contributions the more I am impressed. I hope you will only see my efforts as a contribution.

Sincerely, Jon